Kobe?

[mikeman]

There is some reason to think this thing came apart in the air.

This was posted across the street, it's possible even if the pilot was proficient enough to avoid this, he might have been distracted by kobe or others during the crucial seconds when this was happening?

 

Once an aircraft enters conditions under which the pilot cannot see a distinct visual horizon, the drift in the inner ear continues uncorrected. Errors in the perceived rate of turn about any axis can build up at a rate of 0.2 to 0.3 degrees per second[citation needed]. If the pilot is not proficient in the use of gyroscopic flight instruments, these errors will build up to a point that control of the aircraft is lost, usually in a steep, diving turn known as a graveyard spiral. During the entire time, leading up to and well into the maneuver, the pilot remains unaware that he is turning, believing that he is maintaining straight flight. One of the most famous mishaps in aviation history involving the graveyard spiral is the crash involving John F. Kennedy Jr. in 1999.[5]

The graveyard spiral usually terminates when the g-forces on the aircraft build up to and exceed the structural strength of the airframe, resulting in catastrophic failure, or when the aircraft contacts the ground. In a 1954 study (180 – Degree Turn Experiment), the University of Illinois Institute of Aviation[6] found that 19 out of 20 non-instrument-rated subject pilots went into a graveyard spiral soon after entering simulated instrument conditions. The 20th pilot also lost control of his aircraft, but in another maneuver. The average time between onset of instrument conditions and loss of control was 178 seconds.

Spatial disorientation can also affect instrument-rated pilots in certain conditions. A powerful tumbling sensation (vertigo) can be set up if the pilot moves his or her head too much during instrument flight. This is called the Coriolis illusion.[citation needed] Pilots are also susceptible to spatial disorientation during night flight over featureless terrain

 

 

Spatial disorientation, spatial unawareness, or "Spatial-D" is the inability to determine one's position, location, and motion relative to their environment.[1] This phenomenon most commonly affects aircraft pilots and underwater divers,[2] but also can be induced in normal conditions—or reproduced in the lab with instruments such as the Barany Chair. In aviation, the term means the inability to correctly interpret aircraft attitude, altitude or airspeed, in relation to the ground or point of reference. This most commonly occurs after a reference point (e.g., the horizon) has been lost. Spatial disorientation, often referred to as 'Spatial-D' by aviators occurs when aircrew's sensory interpretation of their position or motion conflicts with reality. Spatial disorientation is often separated into 3 main categories by mishap investigators:

[Brock Landers]

[rjt]

^

 

Why do you keep posting that?

[CarolinaKid]

yea i think posting this is in very bad taste......

[D-Hustle]

maybe because kobe is a rapist

[mikeman]

^

 

Why do you keep posting that?

Perhaps he thinks Kobe was a horrible human being? That would be my guess, I'm much more interested in the crash than the man, as I said originally, I dont have a single memory of Kobe other than how he was a total ball hog at the end.

[D-Hustle]

kobe wasn't a nice person.  guy hated everyone Dwight Howard, Shaq etc.  kobe didn't invite a single teammate to his wedding.  didn't eat with the team on the road.  didn't attend shaq's wedding.  what a douche

 

Shaw questioned why he would believe that when Bryant did not join the team for dinners on the road, failed to attend O'Neal's wedding though invited, and did not invite a single teammate to his own wedding.

[CarolinaKid]

you can count your real friends on one hand, if it work for him i say it ok..

[housepicks]

I hope wade gets fucked in the ass by a bodybuilder fagg it

[CarolinaKid]

some people are private persons and dont get into that buddy   buddy thing, i know im one of those people too.

[Teddy kgb]

Arie Shafer just wrote his own death sentence.....went after Kobe Hard and the death threats won’t stop coming

[rjt]

“Kobe Bryant died 23 years too late today. He got away with rape because all the Hollywood liberals who attack comedy enjoy rooting for the Lakers more than they dislike rape. Big ups to the hero who forgot to gas up his chopper. I hate the Lakers. What a great day! #F***thelakers.”

[mikeman]

Arie Shafer just wrote his own death sentence.....went after Kobe Hard and the death threats won’t stop coming

Who's he?

[Teddy kgb]

Who's he?

Nobody really.....I just know he’s a Joe Rogan hanger on and a shitty comedian

[mikeman]

kobe wasn't a nice person.  guy hated everyone Dwight Howard, Shaq etc.  kobe didn't invite a single teammate to his wedding.  didn't eat with the team on the road.  didn't attend shaq's wedding.  what a douche

 

Shaw questioned why he would believe that when Bryant did not join the team for dinners on the road, failed to attend O'Neal's wedding though invited, and did not invite a single teammate to his own wedding.

Wow, i never heard any of that, if true then kobe really was a scumbag, not to mention a bad teammate.

[Dr. Paddy]

This was posted across the street, it's possible even if the pilot was proficient enough to avoid this, he might have been distracted by kobe or others during the crucial seconds when this was happening?

 

Once an aircraft enters conditions under which the pilot cannot see a distinct visual horizon, the drift in the inner ear continues uncorrected. Errors in the perceived rate of turn about any axis can build up at a rate of 0.2 to 0.3 degrees per second[citation needed]. If the pilot is not proficient in the use of gyroscopic flight instruments, these errors will build up to a point that control of the aircraft is lost, usually in a steep, diving turn known as a graveyard spiral. During the entire time, leading up to and well into the maneuver, the pilot remains unaware that he is turning, believing that he is maintaining straight flight. One of the most famous mishaps in aviation history involving the graveyard spiral is the crash involving John F. Kennedy Jr. in 1999.[5]

The graveyard spiral usually terminates when the g-forces on the aircraft build up to and exceed the structural strength of the airframe, resulting in catastrophic failure, or when the aircraft contacts the ground. In a 1954 study (180 – Degree Turn Experiment), the University of Illinois Institute of Aviation[6] found that 19 out of 20 non-instrument-rated subject pilots went into a graveyard spiral soon after entering simulated instrument conditions. The 20th pilot also lost control of his aircraft, but in another maneuver. The average time between onset of instrument conditions and loss of control was 178 seconds.

Spatial disorientation can also affect instrument-rated pilots in certain conditions. A powerful tumbling sensation (vertigo) can be set up if the pilot moves his or her head too much during instrument flight. This is called the Coriolis illusion.[citation needed] Pilots are also susceptible to spatial disorientation during night flight over featureless terrain

 

 

Spatial disorientation, spatial unawareness, or "Spatial-D" is the inability to determine one's position, location, and motion relative to their environment.[1] This phenomenon most commonly affects aircraft pilots and underwater divers,[2] but also can be induced in normal conditions—or reproduced in the lab with instruments such as the Barany Chair. In aviation, the term means the inability to correctly interpret aircraft attitude, altitude or airspeed, in relation to the ground or point of reference. This most commonly occurs after a reference point (e.g., the horizon) has been lost. Spatial disorientation, often referred to as 'Spatial-D' by aviators occurs when aircrew's sensory interpretation of their position or motion conflicts with reality. Spatial disorientation is often separated into 3 main categories by mishap investigators:

Yes, that is all true. I have experienced it to the point of puking when I first started instrument training for my night rating. It is an extremely powerful and dangerous sensation and can be brought on by inner ear sensations even when there is no cloud. I once rolled almost upside down, in a clear night sky over Reno while landing. Just by fixating on a star and thinking it was a light on the ground. I rolled upright using the artificial horizon, but the whole thing was very disturbing.

 

It is not only spatial D that might have led to inflight breakup. Retreating blade stall could have led to disk flapping and uncontrollable roll and to the main rotor flapping into the tunnel back from the transmission and which has the tail rotor drive shaft mounted on top. That would cut off the whole back end. Which is what you can see. The tunnel is near to the passenger compartment, but separated. It is the white and blue object in the pictures and video. But the actual vertical fin at the back, which has the tail rotor mounted at the top, is separated from the tunnel and at some distance from the wreck. One report has it on one side of a hill with the rest on the other side and a wreckage trail of 500 to 600 feet.  But, I saw that early on, and in some video when the view is wide enough, you can see the main wreckage and this fin in the frame, but certainly at some distance. 

 

There is talk that he said he was going to climb above the cloud layer. In order to do that, he would have had to enter cloud, which would mean he would have needed an IFR clearance, which he couldn't have gotten at that location without declaring an emergency. That aircraft would certainly have had a full autopilot. All he has to do is is command the AP to hover, then tower up to whatever altitude he chose. I expect the top of the cloud was no more than 3000 feet. But his last ADS-B hit coincides almost exactly over that church that eyewitness was at when he heard him pass overhead. He shows 2000 feet, a southeast heading, and a speed of 132 knots. Within a few moments, there is a thump and the sound of things breaking.

 

At 2000 feet, there are dozens of these home based ADS receivers, which link to FlightAware and other flight following internet sites, that would be in range almost down to the ground, or on the ground. ADS-B also links back to the satellite that is feeding the GPS, and that then downlinks to ATC. I think, maybe not. But something happened to that system at 2000 feet, because that was the last transmission to any ADS receiver.  The effect of that was an electrical failure, or cutting off the link from the gear to the ADS antennae. Or both. 

 

The NTSB will certainly be looking at some event in the air as the cause of this.

You certainly seem to understand a fair bit of this, Mike. I'll have to change my sig line.

[mikeman]

When that happens with airplanes they are presumably much higher above the ground and have a larger margin of error, that helicopter was likely only a few hundred ft above the ground most of it's journey.

[Dr. Paddy]

When that happens with airplanes they are presumably much higher above the ground and have a larger margin of error, that helicopter was likely only a few hundred ft above the ground most of it's journey.

It seems that way. At some point, it was only 300 feet above ground, if you look at that Flight Aware stuff I think I posted. 

 

This a link to a CNN story from a half hour ago. It has a lot of absolute horseshit in it. But it does describe the wreckage pattern, and shows a picture of the weather and the crash site. What is unusual is that the wreckage is in a depression, which is unusual for controlled flight into terrain, especially when the aircraft was at least 1000 feet above that site and climbing. It seems to argue that it fell out of the sky into there. 

 

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/28/us/helicopter-crash-kobe-bryant-tuesday/index.html

[Brock Landers]

Paddy

 

Do you think they were aware they were about to die?

 

Do you think it was painful or quick and basically painless?

[Dr. Paddy]

That depends on whether the aircraft came apart in the air or flew into the ground. I would think that at least the pilot knew he was in great danger, probably the pax knew something was wrong. If something went bang in the air, as it must have, yes, they would have been terrified.

They would have died instantly at impact.

I'm going to link everyone who is interested into the PPrune pilot's forum, the largest in the world. Some of these people are far more expert than I am. There is an enormous source of good info on this site.

 

I will link to PPrune in my next post. This picture is taken from the height of the helicopter of the yellow pin marked Last ADS hit at 2000 feet. It is what the pilot would have seen in clear air from the bottom pin. The second yellow pin is where that excellent eyewitness guy was when he heard the aircraft pass over in fog. He shows up in the PPrune thread and says he thinks it was only 150 feet into the cloud base. I don't know exactly where the wreckage is, but it is inside the reddish "blanket" over the hills. There is a bar right at the margin at bottom right, showing a 500 foot distance. It looks like it moved forward about 7 to 800 feet from the last ADS reported position.

 

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipPH1Wp_WivJqhUqvQBcDBCNNJU4lxVboPvZSp-x

 

[KingKolzig]

Paddy

 

Do you think they were aware they were about to die?

 

Do you think it was painful or quick and basically painless?

 

so not only are you a super-loser but your a sick little fuck too

 

fuck off and die

[Dr. Paddy]

so not only are you a super-loser but your a sick little fuck too

 

fuck off and die

Ah, well, it is very commonly asked, including by family of the victims. I've been asked it many times.

 

When an aircraft explodes, it is very highly unlikely that anyone dies from the fire. Aircraft fuel tanks are very protected and strong. The impact to burst a fuel tank is so great that no one on board would survive and the fire would be post death.But, I did an coroner's inquest once helping victim lawyers, and that plane caught fire, and they all perished from burns and asphyxiation

 

This is the PPrune link.

 

https://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/629197-kobe-bryant-killed-s76-crash.html.

[D-Hustle]

I hope wade gets fucked in the ass by a bodybuilder fagg it

 

hopefully you do since you support scumbag rapists

[Brock Landers]

Paddy

 

This seems to be very informative

 

I think kobe was being a cowboy, too much to prove at all times and needlessly got that helicopter going. A limo would have been the best option in questionable weather

 

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/2020/01/28/kobe-bryant-crash-helicopter-flying-very-scary-conditions/4591226002/

[Dr. Paddy]

Paddy

 

This seems to be very informative

 

I think kobe was being a cowboy, too much to prove at all times and needlessly got that helicopter going. A limo would have been the best option in questionable weather

 

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/2020/01/28/kobe-bryant-crash-helicopter-flying-very-scary-conditions/4591226002/

No, it's not really very informative. You know you're in for some Yankee horseshit when some "expert" is quoted as saying Kobe was one of the most important people in the world. He was no more, nor no less, important than anyone else. 

 

It didn't crash in Calabasas. It crashed in Malibu Creek.

 

He was in no trouble at all when he ran into reduced visibility near Glendale. He simply requested the usual permission required to fly below VFR minimums of 1000 foot AGL ceiling and 3 miles visibility. The visibility was down to 2.5 miles, so technically below VFR and requiring special VFR. But not "trouble". 

 

He wasn't down 100 feet above the ground. You can't even get Special VFR if you have a 100 foot ceiling and dozens of people would have gotten his tail numbers and called the police, and he would have lost his license. He didn't declare an emergency, never said he was in trouble. If he was in trouble he would have landed. There are thousands of places to land there, including the airports at Burbank and Van Nuys. As you can see, he is flying his holding pattern over Glendale. That was because he had to wait for clearance to enter the Burbank control zone in special VFR.

 

Police pilots couldn't hold a commercial flying job where I live. They are so cautious they get nothing done. The RCMP up here have issues with the timidity of their own pilots. They say the pilots have a motto "If there's a cloud in the sky, we don't fly".

 

You can see in the altitude tape that he was at 2000 feet near the accident site. That was on top of the fog with 30 miles visibility.

 

So, no, nothing important. The media seems to pick the worst buffoons as "experts".